IiPunch - Monk Guide

Couldn't you just alternatively build a counter set and sub RUN to make up the meva difference? That seems healthier and doesn't require MP to maintain.

Also if you are wearing Cyclas +1, why wouldn't you use Mpaca Hands and Legs to further the gains you are getting and only sacrificing about 100 Meva while actually capping PDT.

I dont know exactly how you want to make up that massive meva loss with 3 runes and each only giving 25 resist vs one element. Cocoon is 10 mp and I only mentioned that as option if counter is really important. Also keep in mind counterstance caps your counter rate in all sets. You are physically the most vulnerable during WS, not during TP. Counterstance also boosts damage from counters.


Not sure if you know how meva works. You need enough meva to resist something or you wont resist it period. Its not a matter of random. You already dropping 70 meva on body, if you drop 100 more, you are in territory of definitely not enough meva.

Your Impetus set a 1.4% dps gain at attack cap and ~2.6% with uncapped attack, so that mpaca legs and hands doesnt add that much dps. Like I said its a good set if you dont need meva but need PDT.

Isn't it only two runes? You also still have to cast cocoon to maintain it, quite often. Run also has the Tenacity trait, Valation and Plfug.

Regardless I guess this conversation is a bit moot because the instances you want to counter are not the same instances that you would need meva.

Yeah it might be only 2 runes, i haven't used /run in a while. Anyway pflug and tanacity are separate from meva. They are nice but they are not reliable, especially from run sub job. Valiance only works for damage and my concern would be debuffs not magic damage usually.

You are right about counter vs meva probably. Better discussion would be using /blu and counterstance vs counter build with other sub job, when you really want counter.

it is 2 runes

the guide is starting to show its age, could use a little updating. does anybody have a H2H weapon guide/suggestion in order best to meh that MNK should be using. i messed with MNK a lot back in the day and was my main for a long while.... until it became the loljob turns out its kinda useful for odyssey. so i decided to start messing it again. my current weapon is a Suwaiyas. and i'm kicking around the idea of getting a REMA. i know godhands are amung the top if not THE best H2H, but what are my other optoins. how bad is Sapari? also i'm mid working on greataxe otherwise id make it my next aonic. is getting a Spharai a waste? is kaja/ambu item better?

Godhands are not the best. They are only best when you either can't SC and are spamming something like howling or FW is up. Karambit are better than Godhands outside of footwork for both spamming and skillchaining. Karambit are also better better than spharai as well and almost always better than glanzfaust. Verethragna are the best for both spamming and doing self skillchain outside of footwork.
That's also assuming R15 for all RMEA, without max augments, Karambit obviously compares even better.

Get Karambit, finish Chango and probably pass on GH for awhile unless you can R15 it for the small window or few situations it would be best.

whoa. so abyss H2H is that good? do you just spam Asuran Fists for best effectiveness? its been a while since i touched MNK and it has a LOT of new stuff going for it. kick attack rate is kinda hot pretty much having 3 attacks per round once you get geared up (minimum) i messed with footworks a bit wearing some of the kick attack boots back in abyssea days and it just kinda fell behind other DPS and even non-footwork builds. i guess its still kinda meh unless you have a R15 godhands?

Not usually. Some case for it if you have high enough attack and need to avoid skill chains. Asuran is really easy to gear at least. I use mine when I can make darkness with another DD even with RMEA.

Really its just the combination of having a premium stat line with good stat mods and a strong effect. Store tp +50 on every crit is no joke. And with monk's gear options and impetus timer it has a pretty absurd crit rate. Godhands has a tp bonus, but karambit builds tp faster. It's just a really strong weapon.

so how do they stack up against sapari? would i just be wasting time getting those? there not terribly too expensive. no more expensive than trying to find a glowy weapon.

karambit beat spharai for dps in basically every situation. relic is for the counters only.

noted, thanks. hopefully they fix the aftermath on them to not suck quite as much. if it proced on off hand/DA/TA/QA would they be worth it?

i don't care to change my function to find ou t, but they would obviously be better. but since it's SE we're talking about, vere would still ***on them for DPS since it would be the same thing

In the Monk H2H choices thread you posted some sim that compared each weapon with Impetus up and Down and both situations you had GH pulling ahead of Karambit. Also how could Karambit possibly be better when you are making skillchains, if you factor in GH aftermath and radiance potential than GH should blow Karambit out of the water.

Those were all with footwork if you mean my recently posted numbers. GH aftermath is also not used since TK > TK > TK does not use shijin spiral, which is why I suggested spiral > DK > Smite which does. GH cannot do spiral > smite > smite like karambit can for the other four out of five minutes when no footwork.

I can run that situation if you want, though

What crit rate are we assuming for Karambit? Without Impetus and around a 42% crit rate, I am seeing that Karambit's TP rate is about 5% above Godhands but GH has a much higher base damage, TP bonus and 10 additional STP when Weapon skilling.

I'd be curious to see how that situation looks and how Raging / Howling spams look for GH vs. Karambit without Impetus.

I just can't wrap my head around Karambit being better than Godhands in every situation but FW.

I'm not assuming any specific crit rate. It updates every melee hit for impetus.

I stated earlier when you can't SC and have to spam howling or something it would be better. Karambit has better SCs outside of FW, though.

But if you have sets I can run them.

Cost is not even close. Can just buy 5 pulse cells, which I see is currently going to run you 25-30M (EDIT: not 25-30k, thanks Austar!) on Bismarck. That + some ambu for the R/E items = you have your final stage Karambit.

Spharai are going to run you over 30M for the Dyna currency ALONE. And that's just to get the level 75 relic, you then need to:
- Do a bunch of tedious trials (that will take far more time than the Ambu points needed for Abdhaljs upgrade items)
- Spend another 30M+ worth of marrow/plutons to upgrade the weapon to 119
- Then spend 80-90M worth of Detritus to take it to R15.

All for a final stage weapon that's going to be worse DPS than Karambit but may have some niche applications for counter builds.

I think you mean 25-30M for Karambit.

But the T3 Behemoth can be done solo pretty easily.

The stronger Asuran is nice though when you need to use gravitation WS, so it's still worth having.

TY, yes... didn't mean 25k :) And yeah, this is only if you are not interested in just farming the weapon yourself, whether from Zitah T3 or elsewhere.

I had decent luck getting a couple polearms from Bismarck during the VW campaigns, and seen multiple shiny weapons from two characters' worth of monthly AMAN trove. And PSA for people who might not have been keeping up to date on Deeds of Heroism, you get a free shiny weapon at 170 points (40/month from 4 easy quests), so how long this takes depends on when you started and you might be close.

But worst case scenario, you go to the AH and can buy your shiny weapon for a cost in the same ballpark as a lv75 relic that will still need a lot of additional investment

Keep in mind Relics will get updated and few of them might become great. Price will skyrocket then, so it might be better to do them now.

Since when did SE say they will upgrade any relics? They said they were doing that with the R15 patch and failed miserably.

They said that several months ago when someone asked why Final Heaven is still so weak when they updated all other H2H WS.
They replied (in japanese) that they didn't touch Final Heaven because they have bigger plans to update all Relics.
Whatever they meant with that, we don't know.

But not long after that reply they released The Voracious Resurgence artwork, in which you can see all characters using black models of Relic weapons.

A lot of people rightfully suspect that it can't be a coincidence and that The Voracious Resurgence storyline will eventually lead to "upgrading" relics to their black versions, with updated stats.

Nobody knows for sure though, of course. As far as we know they might have changed their plans and leave Relics like they are now forever.

Pretty sure even if they wont update relics, they will update WSs on them.

What they said in the past seems to hint AT LEAST to that, I agree with you and I'm one of the people who believes in the "something is gonna happen".

Just wanted to point out though that just because we believe that and just because it's likely, doesn't mean it's gonna 100% happen. Wouldn't be the first time they go back on their word after all would it?

If someone wants to make a 150M+ final stage Spharai in the hopes that it MIGHT get upgraded (or even the 65~70M-ish of currency/plutons to make it 119) and that the upgrade is worthwhile... OK, caveat emptor. Just be aware that this is a pretty significant gamble in the hopes of investing now in order to save some gil on relic currency/plutons (and to a lesser extent, detritus that is used in all RMEA augments) in the event that relics get upgrades and prices on those upgrade items go up.

And that's assuming any relic weapon/WS revisions are even good enough to let Spharai leapfrog other options. Personally, I'd rather wait and see, and if the surprise result is that Spharai becomes the #1 MNK option that I just have to have, then I guess I pay the extra gil to get it at that point.

If you care about what does the best for your MNK today?
1) Make Verethragna if you want the best of the best.
2) For anyone not making Verethragna, grab a Karambit.
3) If you want additional flexibility, get Godhands I guess (assuming you don't have more impactful Aeonic priorities for other jobs, which is the situation a lot of people will be in).
4) Spharai is more for hardcore MNK completionists (super narrow counter build niche), and
5) Glanzfaust is only for the collect-them-all, DPS be damned, MNK fanatics.

If only Spharai becomes #1, then its probably not a problem. If 10 relics becomes competitive, then you will pay probably 200M instead of 60 and not only for Spharai, but probably for few more relics :D Ofc Im not saying to make Spharai before Veret. Im saying to think about Spharai after you get current best options :)

Anyone who thinks 10 relics are going to go from uncompetitive to competitive is FAR more optimistic than I am! :) Valid enough point if you're a gambler though, guess we'll see.

Currently we're basically looking at 5/16 "good" relics already (Apoc, Anni, Kikoku, Gjallarhorn, Aegis). So while I know you're just throwing a number out there saying 10... that's a serious relic overhaul if it totally changes the perception of 10 of the 11 of the relics that aren't currently "worth it" (outside of people who just want to make them for mostly sentimental reasons, which is totally legitimate!).

I guess you can never say never when it comes to dreams though. God knows I'm sitting on a 4/4 R15 RMEA Ninja just waiting for the day we get a katana WS overhaul and I become the king of the world. XD

You're never more than a 1 or a 0 away from any item being better than any other item. It's just when will they flip it.

Relics been bad for a while sooner or later the next thing makes them all best again, for a year, then they flip another 1/0 and mythics take over.

ex; relic procs now include all ws; 0 turned into a 1, literally everyones head explodes and the scramble for relics is afoot.