I personally don't know what R15 Apoc parses like, but for most content I assume you'd be fine, at least until you can find something that can fund you building a more DPS focused weapon.
Apoc offers great survival options, although, DRK when played attentively is already fairly hard to kill if you're making good use of Nether Void, Dread Spikes, and DT sets.
I can speak from experience though as a RDM that does Croc Mors melee in Dyna and other things, that while other DD's can out DPS me with ease, they often don't outparse me because the chances of me dying are slim to none... and no deaths not only means no weakness, but that I will always have buffs... just something worth considering that spreadsheets (while often fairly accurate) don't really account for.
Just bear in mind there are people that know more about this than me.
(Don't) Fear The Reaper: A Dark Knight Guide
(Don't) Fear the Reaper: A Dark Knight Guide
I think the real potency of Apoc is irrelevant here because its more about people mindset. If I would take my idea of TP bonus offand on blu before everyone were convinced about how good it is, I would probably not be taken seriously too.
So make R15 Apoc and get motente+1 or raetic algol +1. One is free and other one is cheap and both are widely accepted as dps focused weapons for war and drk.
So make R15 Apoc and get motente+1 or raetic algol +1. One is free and other one is cheap and both are widely accepted as dps focused weapons for war and drk.
[+]
I have R15 Apoc and Cala.
There really isn’t a comparison in terms of sheer DPS. Tor drops 40-60k bombs with triple damage melee Swings.
Cata tops out around 29k. But as mentioned above it keeps your HP topped off with every WS. It’s a hybrid weapon pairs well with SE and takes a ton of pressure off your healers. Low man, PUG, solo it’s a great choice.
There really isn’t a comparison in terms of sheer DPS. Tor drops 40-60k bombs with triple damage melee Swings.
Cata tops out around 29k. But as mentioned above it keeps your HP topped off with every WS. It’s a hybrid weapon pairs well with SE and takes a ton of pressure off your healers. Low man, PUG, solo it’s a great choice.
R15 Apoc is really nice. You can play really aggressive with it.
It's like grabbing the bull by the horns and head butting the ***out of it at the same time
It all depends on how much you trust your WHMs. 90% of the time I use my apoc. I just made my Calad and I find myself too chicken ***to use it unless a certain player has my back on WHM.
It's more of a "slow and steady wins the race" kind of weapons. Calad/Anguta does better for Zergs. Still it's nothing to sneeze it.
It's like grabbing the bull by the horns and head butting the ***out of it at the same time
It all depends on how much you trust your WHMs. 90% of the time I use my apoc. I just made my Calad and I find myself too chicken ***to use it unless a certain player has my back on WHM.
It's more of a "slow and steady wins the race" kind of weapons. Calad/Anguta does better for Zergs. Still it's nothing to sneeze it.
[+]
Fenrir.Skarwind said: »
R15 Apoc is really nice. You can play really aggressive with it.
It's like grabbing the bull by the horns and head butting the ***out of it at the same time
It all depends on how much you trust your WHMs. 90% of the time I use my apoc. I just made my Calad and I find myself too chicken ***to use it unless a certain player has my back on WHM.
It's more of a "slow and steady wins the race" kind of weapons. Calad/Anguta does better for Zergs. Still it's nothing to sneeze it.
It's like grabbing the bull by the horns and head butting the ***out of it at the same time
It all depends on how much you trust your WHMs. 90% of the time I use my apoc. I just made my Calad and I find myself too chicken ***to use it unless a certain player has my back on WHM.
It's more of a "slow and steady wins the race" kind of weapons. Calad/Anguta does better for Zergs. Still it's nothing to sneeze it.
Right, this is exactly what I was wanting to say when I mentioned Croc for RDM being very similar. I may not be able to win in sheer numbers, but the fact that I don't have to be cautious means I spend more time fighting, and you end up getting more DPS in that security unless you have top tier WHMs... because if you don't and you act that way with a less safe weapon, you'll end up pushing daisies and losing all your buffs.
Fenrir.Skarwind said: »
I just made my Calad and I find myself too chicken ***to use it unless a certain player has my back on WHM.
Torcleaver the ***out of everything
[+]
I was just talking to some LS mates about this. I have both Calad and Apoc at Rank 15 and enjoy it both.
While pure DPS wise Caladbolg wins, Apoc isn't something to scoff at either. I average 25-30k Catas with the odd big number ones up to 60k. Where I found that it shines however is with Cross Reaper averaging 40k as a lowball, can be pushed higher depending on buffs.
At the end of the day, do what you want and play how you want. Eventually as a career DRK you'd want a few R15, doesn't really matter which way you go about it first as long as you know the differences between weapon potential.
While pure DPS wise Caladbolg wins, Apoc isn't something to scoff at either. I average 25-30k Catas with the odd big number ones up to 60k. Where I found that it shines however is with Cross Reaper averaging 40k as a lowball, can be pushed higher depending on buffs.
At the end of the day, do what you want and play how you want. Eventually as a career DRK you'd want a few R15, doesn't really matter which way you go about it first as long as you know the differences between weapon potential.
Anyone used fully Aug father time and is the wsd and extra drain worth it
Pilipinoboi said: »
I was just talking to some LS mates about this. I have both Calad and Apoc at Rank 15 and enjoy it both.
While pure DPS wise Caladbolg wins, Apoc isn't something to scoff at either. I average 25-30k Catas with the odd big number ones up to 60k. Where I found that it shines however is with Cross Reaper averaging 40k as a lowball, can be pushed higher depending on buffs.
At the end of the day, do what you want and play how you want. Eventually as a career DRK you'd want a few R15, doesn't really matter which way you go about it first as long as you know the differences between weapon potential.
While pure DPS wise Caladbolg wins, Apoc isn't something to scoff at either. I average 25-30k Catas with the odd big number ones up to 60k. Where I found that it shines however is with Cross Reaper averaging 40k as a lowball, can be pushed higher depending on buffs.
At the end of the day, do what you want and play how you want. Eventually as a career DRK you'd want a few R15, doesn't really matter which way you go about it first as long as you know the differences between weapon potential.
Starting to wonder if my character is naturally gimp. Granted I don't have R15 apoc yet, I only see 15k cats on average. Only item I'm missing from WS set is new JSE neck, or will both those items boost the damage up that much?
Shiva.Humpo said: »
Pilipinoboi said: »
I was just talking to some LS mates about this. I have both Calad and Apoc at Rank 15 and enjoy it both.
While pure DPS wise Caladbolg wins, Apoc isn't something to scoff at either. I average 25-30k Catas with the odd big number ones up to 60k. Where I found that it shines however is with Cross Reaper averaging 40k as a lowball, can be pushed higher depending on buffs.
At the end of the day, do what you want and play how you want. Eventually as a career DRK you'd want a few R15, doesn't really matter which way you go about it first as long as you know the differences between weapon potential.
While pure DPS wise Caladbolg wins, Apoc isn't something to scoff at either. I average 25-30k Catas with the odd big number ones up to 60k. Where I found that it shines however is with Cross Reaper averaging 40k as a lowball, can be pushed higher depending on buffs.
At the end of the day, do what you want and play how you want. Eventually as a career DRK you'd want a few R15, doesn't really matter which way you go about it first as long as you know the differences between weapon potential.
Starting to wonder if my character is naturally gimp. Granted I don't have R15 apoc yet, I only see 15k cats on average. Only item I'm missing from WS set is new JSE neck, or will both those items boost the damage up that much?
They are both large boost yes.
Rank15 Apoc takes your Cata multiplier from 1.4 to 1.68. Neck is a full 10% boost to pdif on a job with the highest pdif.
With that considered to hit 29xxx i have to be pdif capped and my Cata set is BiS.
ItemSet 362699
Shiva.Humpo said: »
Pilipinoboi said: »
I was just talking to some LS mates about this. I have both Calad and Apoc at Rank 15 and enjoy it both.
While pure DPS wise Caladbolg wins, Apoc isn't something to scoff at either. I average 25-30k Catas with the odd big number ones up to 60k. Where I found that it shines however is with Cross Reaper averaging 40k as a lowball, can be pushed higher depending on buffs.
At the end of the day, do what you want and play how you want. Eventually as a career DRK you'd want a few R15, doesn't really matter which way you go about it first as long as you know the differences between weapon potential.
While pure DPS wise Caladbolg wins, Apoc isn't something to scoff at either. I average 25-30k Catas with the odd big number ones up to 60k. Where I found that it shines however is with Cross Reaper averaging 40k as a lowball, can be pushed higher depending on buffs.
At the end of the day, do what you want and play how you want. Eventually as a career DRK you'd want a few R15, doesn't really matter which way you go about it first as long as you know the differences between weapon potential.
Starting to wonder if my character is naturally gimp. Granted I don't have R15 apoc yet, I only see 15k cats on average. Only item I'm missing from WS set is new JSE neck, or will both those items boost the damage up that much?
Without neck (like without any neck at all, because no time for calculating alternatives now) and with AG Apoc on target with 250 vit, with capped attack and without STR buffs, you should do around ~18-19k Catastrophe without MA proc.
With R15 Apoc and JSE neck +2, this value jumps to 26k+
10%PDL and 20%Cata damage are alone worth +32% damage to Cata.
I'm not buying 40k Cross Reaper avg at all tho. That would require capped attack CC Fighter's roll and WSing at close to 2000TP or some perfect Scarlet Delirium usage. Unless those numbers comes from Escha, while also prebuffing yourself with absorb STR and MND with mythic, some TP overflow, some Scarlet and Fighter's roll, then I can believe it :P EDIT: or they come from dynamis zones with bonus damage.
Whether it's Apocalypse, Caladbolg, Anguta or even Liberator, take whichever weapon to Rank 15 that you want. With enough time (and/or Gil) you can upgrade all of them.
That said, personally I chose to rank up Apocalypse first and I honestly haven't been disappointed. The damage increase is nice, although the boost to Drain/Aspir was my real primary motivation.
That said, personally I chose to rank up Apocalypse first and I honestly haven't been disappointed. The damage increase is nice, although the boost to Drain/Aspir was my real primary motivation.
Sylph.Brahmsz said: »
Whether it's Apocalypse, Caladbolg, Anguta or even Liberator, take whichever weapon to Rank 15 that you want. With enough time (and/or Gil) you can upgrade all of them.
That said, personally I chose to rank up Apocalypse first and I honestly haven't been disappointed. The damage increase is nice, although the boost to Drain/Aspir was my real primary motivation.
That said, personally I chose to rank up Apocalypse first and I honestly haven't been disappointed. The damage increase is nice, although the boost to Drain/Aspir was my real primary motivation.
Shouldn't you buy Father Time then? Path C is bis for Drain. Also I don't think any of them give boost to Aspir.
[+]
SimonSes said: »
Sylph.Brahmsz said: »
Whether it's Apocalypse, Caladbolg, Anguta or even Liberator, take whichever weapon to Rank 15 that you want. With enough time (and/or Gil) you can upgrade all of them.
That said, personally I chose to rank up Apocalypse first and I honestly haven't been disappointed. The damage increase is nice, although the boost to Drain/Aspir was my real primary motivation.
That said, personally I chose to rank up Apocalypse first and I honestly haven't been disappointed. The damage increase is nice, although the boost to Drain/Aspir was my real primary motivation.
Shouldn't you buy Father Time then? Path C is bis for Drain. Also I don't think any of them give boost to Aspir.
Eh, Father Time is only 5% higher than Misanthropy. But is that 5% worth 90~100M? Not really.
Also, since the conversation was partially about the benefits of using/Rank 15'ing Apocalypse, the extra Drain+10% is simply an added bonus. :)
Sylph.Brahmsz said: »
the extra Drain+10% is simply an added bonus. :)
That I can easily agree with :)
I recently mastered DRK and built some BiS slots and let me just say that Torcleaver is absolutely insane. This job does not disappoint. I joined an Omen Gin group on DRK (basically to get some cards) but the WS numbers I was doing were crazy.. 50-80k on Midboss/Mega and basically just crushing the content. Super fun!
[+]
Asura.Toralin said: »
I recently mastered DRK and built some BiS slots and let me just say that Torcleaver is absolutely insane. This job does not disappoint. I joined an Omen Gin group on DRK (basically to get some cards) but the WS numbers I was doing were crazy.. 50-80k on Midboss/Mega and basically just crushing the content. Super fun!
Time to R15 an Apoc! Apoc is more fun that Cala IMO.
[+]
Caladbolg R15/Liberator R15/Fathertime R25 PathB so far. Yeah Apoc next sounds about right then Anguta>Redemption.
Torc Set:
sets.precast.WS['Torcleaver'] = {
ammo="Knobkierrie",
head=OdysHead.WSD,
body="Ignominy Cuirass +3",
hands=OdysHands.WSDVITACC,
legs="Fall. Flanchard +3",
feet="Sulev. Leggings +2",
neck="Abyssal Beads +2",
waist="Fotia Belt",
left_ear="Moonshade earring",
right_ear="Ishvara Earring",
left_ring="Regal Ring",
right_ring="Epaminondas's Ring",
back=Ankou.WSDVIT}
OdysHead.WSD= { name="Odyssean Helm", augments={'Accuracy+25','Weapon skill damage +3%','VIT+15','Attack+5',}}
OdysHands.WSDVITACC={ name="Odyssean Gauntlets", augments={'Attack+20','Weapon skill damage +4%','VIT+12','Accuracy+14',}}
Need to check if this will be any good too compared with above ody hands:
ValoHands.WSD = { name="Valorous Mitts", augments={'VIT+2','Pet: STR+10','Weapon skill damage +8%',}}
Edit: Fixed link!
Torc Set:
sets.precast.WS['Torcleaver'] = {
ammo="Knobkierrie",
head=OdysHead.WSD,
body="Ignominy Cuirass +3",
hands=OdysHands.WSDVITACC,
legs="Fall. Flanchard +3",
feet="Sulev. Leggings +2",
neck="Abyssal Beads +2",
waist="Fotia Belt",
left_ear="Moonshade earring",
right_ear="Ishvara Earring",
left_ring="Regal Ring",
right_ring="Epaminondas's Ring",
back=Ankou.WSDVIT}
OdysHead.WSD= { name="Odyssean Helm", augments={'Accuracy+25','Weapon skill damage +3%','VIT+15','Attack+5',}}
OdysHands.WSDVITACC={ name="Odyssean Gauntlets", augments={'Attack+20','Weapon skill damage +4%','VIT+12','Accuracy+14',}}
Need to check if this will be any good too compared with above ody hands:
ValoHands.WSD = { name="Valorous Mitts", augments={'VIT+2','Pet: STR+10','Weapon skill damage +8%',}}
Edit: Fixed link!
[+]
Solo Gin and possibly Fu as well after I work out the kinks. Apoc is a beast.
Taint said: »
Apoc is more fun that Cala IMO.
Don't tell Volkom I said that tho.
[+]
Thanks for all the replies all! I think I'll make a 119 Caladbolg first but R15 my Apoc down the line, first.
This is exactly how I feel when I am wielding my Apoc. I can use things like souleater and last resort without much fear of dying.
Also, up until now I have mostly been playing with PUG groups and it is so satisfying to pump out solid and often top DPS all while outliving the rest of the party and sometimes even tanking.
I'm sure I'm going to love Caladbolg once I make it, but to me Apoc provides such a unique and satisfying experience that makes me want to challenge everything, push DRK to its limits and bask in the blood of my enemies as I consume it for heals :D
But, ultimately, it feels like Caladbolg will open more doors for me so I can move from PUGs and more into established linkshells, which will ultimately help me R15 my Apoc with Dyanmis clears, etc.
Fenrir.Skarwind said: »
It's like grabbing the bull by the horns and head butting the ***out of it at the same time
This is exactly how I feel when I am wielding my Apoc. I can use things like souleater and last resort without much fear of dying.
Also, up until now I have mostly been playing with PUG groups and it is so satisfying to pump out solid and often top DPS all while outliving the rest of the party and sometimes even tanking.
I'm sure I'm going to love Caladbolg once I make it, but to me Apoc provides such a unique and satisfying experience that makes me want to challenge everything, push DRK to its limits and bask in the blood of my enemies as I consume it for heals :D
But, ultimately, it feels like Caladbolg will open more doors for me so I can move from PUGs and more into established linkshells, which will ultimately help me R15 my Apoc with Dyanmis clears, etc.
I was debating dumping my swarts on verethragna or apocalypse. Thought I was sold on verethragna until this discussion now I'm having second thoughts...
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
I was debating dumping my swarts on verethragna or apocalypse. Thought I was sold on verethragna until this discussion now I'm having second thoughts...
I have R15 Vere as well....its a crazy strong weapon. DRK is just in a better place right now. Vere during Impetus and Footwork has a very high ceiling but it falls off hard when they are down.
R15 Liberator and call it a day!
I farmed all my swarts from scratch and haven't bought one, but it takes a good bit to cap out a weapon if you're doing it that way. I love Monk but business decisions. I made verethragna specifically for rank 15 but now I'm dreading the idea of making an amazing weapon for a job I'll never get to enjoy.
I was sold on trishula R15 but then shining one came out and then I switched to Monk/dark. Lol I'm so freaking torn. It'll probably end up going to apocalypse but these discussions just irk my soul lol
I was sold on trishula R15 but then shining one came out and then I switched to Monk/dark. Lol I'm so freaking torn. It'll probably end up going to apocalypse but these discussions just irk my soul lol
[+]
vere is a bigger relative dps increase than apoc would be.
[+]
Regarding the different TP sets for Apoc (4 hit, 5 hit, DA), is there one clearly above the other and if so in which situations?
[+]
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
I farmed all my swarts from scratch and haven't bought one, but it takes a good bit to cap out a weapon if you're doing it that way. I love Monk but business decisions. I made verethragna specifically for rank 15 but now I'm dreading the idea of making an amazing weapon for a job I'll never get to enjoy.
I was sold on trishula R15 but then shining one came out and then I switched to Monk/dark. Lol I'm so freaking torn. It'll probably end up going to apocalypse but these discussions just irk my soul lol
I was sold on trishula R15 but then shining one came out and then I switched to Monk/dark. Lol I'm so freaking torn. It'll probably end up going to apocalypse but these discussions just irk my soul lol
You think you have a problem? I had a problem of what to play since forever in this game.
I also only farm myself and I still have those on the radar:
Veret
Apoc
Calad
Fomal
Masamune (Havent even made yet)
Trishula
Chango
Spharai
Nirvana
Doikri (Dont have yet)
Lionheart (Dont have yet)
Terpsi (Havent even made yet)
Liberator (Havent even made yet)
Ukonvasara (Havent even made yet)
Not to mention I still need at least mnk, drk, war, sam, smn +2 necks.. and many +1 su3 sets.
Every day I'm trying to convince myself to drop idea of playing some of those jobs, but can't decide >.>
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