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The Beast Within -- A Guide to Blue Mage
Siren.Kyte
Server: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3332
By Siren.Kyte 2018-06-28 02:17:53
Odin.Tinyattorney said: »5/5 Physical Potency and Magic Accuracy is what I have. I never use CA or BA anymore, and Monster Correlation isn't great. No need to skillchain with spells anymore because CDC to CDC is light?
CA is still useful for extended SCs.
Quote: In the situation where you can't / won't spend the money on amalric +1, is there any reason why you wouldn't use the relic +3 legs instead of Jhakri +2?
There isn't. Relic+2's the second best option.
By Foxfire 2018-06-28 04:12:23
Not having jeuno clear on blu, maybe
but that's not really a deterrent if you're that determined
Sylph.Oraen
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2087
By Sylph.Oraen 2018-06-28 17:45:33
Relic +3 legs are superb. Definitely do what you need to in order to get them. Fantastic MAB option when you need more macc, best in slot single-hit WS piece, and amazing for magical WSs as well. Grab them as soon as you're able.
Bismarck.Zuidar
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1273
By Bismarck.Zuidar 2018-06-28 18:39:26
Not having jeuno clear on blu, maybe
but that's not really a deterrent if you're that determined
Sorry, I can't resist looking at your profile pic LOL. What the hell happened in that?
Bahamut.Negan
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2200
By Bahamut.Negan 2018-06-28 18:41:37
Sorry, I can't resist looking at your profile pic LOL. What the hell happened in that? The greatest FFXI Update in a long time.
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Bismarck.Zuidar
Server: Bismarck
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1273
By Bismarck.Zuidar 2018-06-28 18:43:44
Sorry, I can't resist looking at your profile pic LOL. What the hell happened in that? The greatest FFXI Update in a long time. yeah, one that made someone (or everyone) acting like a freaking chicken
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Cerberus.Boogs
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 233
By Cerberus.Boogs 2018-06-30 09:52:38
There's already a wiki page that explains recast calculation.
I hope you are not referring to the BG wiki page on spell recast. If so, you have clearly not read that page.
Quote: Finally, several generic and job ability specific terms are applied. This section is still heavily under development, as there are many different job abilities that affect recast.
Keep in mind that the final and starting recasts are made to be 10 bits (similar to Flooring). Though SquareEnix goes to great lengths to keep their variable sizes small, they seem to take no issue with floating point operations. And it seems that nothing about these questions are optimized for processing speed. Apart from that, this also means that the order of operations essentially cannot be determined and that the above "1->2->3" is arbitrary.
On the other hand, if you have a different source, please do share.
None of those unknown/somewhat poorly understood factors are relevant to BLU. As far as BLU is concerned, the page is complete.
The formula on that page is either wrong (haste and slow are swapped in sign) or unclear as to how to calculates the multiplicative factor from haste. As is the formula suggests a multiplicative factor of greater than 1 with haste > 0 and slow = 0. The rest of the page suggests that the multiplicative factors are less then one (e.g. the formula for fast cast reduction). These are contradictory.
By Foxfire 2018-06-30 12:46:44
Not having jeuno clear on blu, maybe
but that's not really a deterrent if you're that determined
Sorry, I can't resist looking at your profile pic LOL. What the hell happened in that? Kam'lanaut's sword placed in offhand placed you in T-pose, and doing certain emotes stuck you in certain poses. Jump just made you flap your wings and bang your head. The Chocobo mask was just us going a step further with the joke.
By Nyarlko 2018-06-30 13:51:22
There's already a wiki page that explains recast calculation.
I hope you are not referring to the BG wiki page on spell recast. If so, you have clearly not read that page.
Quote: Finally, several generic and job ability specific terms are applied. This section is still heavily under development, as there are many different job abilities that affect recast.
Keep in mind that the final and starting recasts are made to be 10 bits (similar to Flooring). Though SquareEnix goes to great lengths to keep their variable sizes small, they seem to take no issue with floating point operations. And it seems that nothing about these questions are optimized for processing speed. Apart from that, this also means that the order of operations essentially cannot be determined and that the above "1->2->3" is arbitrary.
On the other hand, if you have a different source, please do share.
None of those unknown/somewhat poorly understood factors are relevant to BLU. As far as BLU is concerned, the page is complete. The formula on that page is either wrong (haste and slow are swapped in sign) or unclear as to how to calculates the multiplicative factor from haste. As is the formula suggests a multiplicative factor of greater than 1 with haste > 0 and slow = 0. The rest of the page suggests that the multiplicative factors are less then one (e.g. the formula for fast cast reduction). These are contradictory.
That page hasn't been updated in several years, and does seem rather overcomplicated for what it is. Most players are not going to understand, nor care about, the server-side handling of the math involved. However, the basics are pretty clear.
Haste/Slow from gear/magic are applied directly to the base recast additively. Then 1/2 Fast Cast is applied to the result additively. Then JA modifiers are applied to that result multiplicatively. Don't think that BLU has any JA mods, so it boils down to: BaseRecast - Haste + Slow + .5FC(floored), with a lower limit of .2 for the total.
If/when aiming for capped recast reduction, I just follow the basic rules of combat haste (256/1024 gear + 448/1024 magic) then tack on .5FC(floored) and the oddball direct reduction piece. Sure, it might be possible that I am not actually perfectly capped and sitting at something like .2003 recast time, but I for one am not going to notice 1-2 frames of animation longer on my recasts. XD
For the record though, the following should have your recasts capped for BLU:
Capped gear (+25% applied, +26% on gear to be sure) + Erratic Flutter (+30%) + Might Guard/Marches (+15%) + Hashishin Bazubands+1 (+14%)
OR
Capped gear (+25% applied, +26% on gear to be sure) + Erratic Flutter (+30%) + Hashishin Bazubands+1 (+14%) + FastCast+22% (maybe +24% to be safe and account for specific haste values on gear if you are at exactly +25% there.)
Merely setting Erratic Flutter w/ the 1200JP gift gives you FC+15% to begin with, which means you only have FC+7% to make up for w/ additional JT tiers and/or gear, so it's actually quite easy to cap out recasts on BLU.
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By Takisan 2018-07-29 12:40:29
Any news/thoughts on the usefulness of Zomorrodnegar? Pretty high base dmg but would that be better for savage blade vs mainhand sequence? And these will be augmentable later on?
By Boshi 2018-07-29 13:37:45
It'd be neat if the aug ended up being matt
Magic Damage +217 is interesting.
the 3 rema are mdmg+186, nibiru is 124.
It has more macc than Tizona (+10 macc +20blue same maccskill)
Sylph.Oraen
Server: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2087
By Sylph.Oraen 2018-07-29 14:25:54
As it currently stands, the weapon is only really good for "holy ***I cannot hit anything" situations, which do not occur commonly on BLU with even moderate support. Sequence has lower base damage but that 500 TP bonus and 10 STP is too good for Savage scenarios. We'll have to wait and see augments before the sword gets any place in the hierarchy.
By Nyarlko 2018-07-29 17:25:41
It'd be neat if the aug ended up being matt
Magic Damage +217 is interesting.
the 3 rema are mdmg+186, nibiru is 124.
It has more macc than Tizona (+10 macc +20blue same maccskill)
From what the devs have said so far, the weapons will have a total of 4 augment paths each, including RMEA.
Odds are good at least one path will be MAB-focused.
By Takisan 2018-07-30 11:31:46
It'd be neat if the aug ended up being matt
Magic Damage +217 is interesting.
the 3 rema are mdmg+186, nibiru is 124.
It has more macc than Tizona (+10 macc +20blue same maccskill)
From what the devs have said so far, the weapons will have a total of 4 augment paths each, including RMEA.
Odds are good at least one path will be MAB-focused.
But no mention of any kind of aftermath for these weapons? I see Zomorrodnegar has 269 weapon skill and parrying same as AGed weapons so I'm assuming no further boost aside from augment paths.
Also I guess they are a bit easier than making a RMEA so shouldn't overtake Tizona or Almace but might be nice offhand? Who knows right? Just tryin to decide to make or not.
Asura.Eiryl
By Asura.Eiryl 2018-07-30 11:40:17
A Tizona with MAB augs might be the new single funniest damn thing I've seen on here, it would certainly make me lawl.
"But it's the right aug cause I get mad MP brah"
Please, when the update drops, check all zonas... there will be at least one...
*Bonus points*, "because zona can get multiple augments, I feel it's time to remove the rare tag and let us obtain multiple of the same weapon"
Leviathan.Isiolia
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 469
By Leviathan.Isiolia 2018-07-30 12:37:01
Eh, might depend more on how hard it ends up being to swap between paths. A good MAB path on that or the new sword would likely be bis by a nice margin due to the much higher magic damage. If swapping between them is as trivial as Nolan gear, then I'd assume that'll end up being common practice for min maxing. Probably won't be, but, remains to be seen.
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Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 109
By Asura.Sirtaint 2018-07-30 13:22:54
You’ll need 4 Tizonas and 2 Almaces to be BiS.
Joking.....i hope.
By Nyarlko 2018-07-30 16:32:14
It'd be neat if the aug ended up being matt
Magic Damage +217 is interesting.
the 3 rema are mdmg+186, nibiru is 124.
It has more macc than Tizona (+10 macc +20blue same maccskill)
From what the devs have said so far, the weapons will have a total of 4 augment paths each, including RMEA.
Odds are good at least one path will be MAB-focused.
But no mention of any kind of aftermath for these weapons? I see Zomorrodnegar has 269 weapon skill and parrying same as AGed weapons so I'm assuming no further boost aside from augment paths.
Also I guess they are a bit easier than making a RMEA so shouldn't overtake Tizona or Almace but might be nice offhand? Who knows right? Just tryin to decide to make or not.
Actually, they specifically mentioned that the Div weapons have no AM on purpose (so they don't straight up replace certain REMA most likely.)
The DT- buffs on COR/BRD daggers do not activate in offhand btw, so there is currently no guarantee that even the Blue Magic Skill+ on the BLU sword will either.. Technically, I have yet to see anyone confirm that ANY of the stats work in offhand.
You’ll need 4 Tizonas and 2 Almaces to be BiS.
Joking.....i hope.
Sincerely doubt that'll be a legit issue since I don't see the Rare tag getting removed from RMEAs ever. lol
But.. I could easily see "dream tiers" in guides having up to 8x Div weapons, depending on job/augs/butterflyfarts/etc. I honestly expect perfectionist CORs to expect to have 6-8 Rostams, just based off of likely aug stats.
._.
By Afania 2018-07-30 19:40:36
But.. I could easily see "dream tiers" in guides having up to 8x Div weapons, depending on job/augs/butterflyfarts/etc. I honestly expect perfectionist CORs to expect to have 6-8 Rostams, just based off of likely aug stats.
._.
I already want 2 before augment system release, so yes to 10 Rostams >.>
I honestly expect perfectionist CORs to expect to have 6-8 Rostams,
Life is so hard.........
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3185
By Asura.Geriond 2018-07-30 21:24:53
The DT- buffs on COR/BRD daggers do not activate in offhand btw, so there is currently no guarantee that even the Blue Magic Skill+ on the BLU sword will either.. Technically, I have yet to see anyone confirm that ANY of the stats work in offhand. According to a COR in my linkshell who tested it, the cor dagger's DT works in offhand, but only if you're also mainhanding one of the 3 dynamis-d weapons.
By Boshi 2018-07-30 21:28:58
Should also test if takin dagger off drops it.
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By Afania 2018-07-31 00:05:13
the cor dagger's DT works in offhand, but only if you're also mainhanding one of the 3 dynamis-d weapons.
Sounds extremely broken unless dt- drops if you unequip the dagger.
I can synth a 2nd one and test it on my end, whats a good testing target ideally with fixed dmg tp moves?
By Nyarlko 2018-07-31 09:02:18
the cor dagger's DT works in offhand, but only if you're also mainhanding one of the 3 dynamis-d weapons.
Sounds extremely broken unless dt- drops if you unequip the dagger.
I can synth a 2nd one and test it on my end, whats a good testing target ideally with fixed dmg tp moves?
Cactuars. Always Cactuars.
Should be simple to test at least. All you should have to do is do 2x rolls while naked, (might be nice to grab a 2nd COR to roll on you too so you have 4x rolls to start with,) then equip 2x of the Div weapons, then piss off a cactuar.
If you see a damage reduction at all, then that confirms that the effect is linked to the weapon and not the buff itself.
If you 4x+ what you'd expect from MH, then it counts everyone's rolls, not just your own.
If you see more DT- than mainhand accounts for, then it works in offhand too.
You'd really only have to do further testing if NO DT- applied, since that would mean the DT- was attached to the roll and not the gear... It's also quite possible that even if it does work when paired, that it's actually a bug and will be fixed once the devs are notified of it. <_<;;
I'm not sure that the conditional DT- weapons like COR daggers actually makes for the best generalized test subject though. I have a feeling that the static stats on other weapons (like the Blue Magic Skill on the sword,) are probably going to apply in full in offhand when unpaired, but we really kind of need someone who owns one to confirm.
As an aside to that... Since it sounds like you have one already, can you please confirm that all of the other/normal stats apply in full while offhanded and unpaired? ^^;;; If the accs/skills don't apply, then the value of these things drops considerably.
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1401
By Asura.Toralin 2018-07-31 10:37:54
the cor dagger's DT works in offhand, but only if you're also mainhanding one of the 3 dynamis-d weapons.
Sounds extremely broken unless dt- drops if you unequip the dagger.
I can synth a 2nd one and test it on my end, whats a good testing target ideally with fixed dmg tp moves? The DT- buffs on COR/BRD daggers do not activate in offhand btw, so there is currently no guarantee that even the Blue Magic Skill+ on the BLU sword will either.. Technically, I have yet to see anyone confirm that ANY of the stats work in offhand. According to a COR in my linkshell who tested it, the cor dagger's DT works in offhand, but only if you're also mainhanding one of the 3 dynamis-d weapons. This is False.
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Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1401
By Asura.Toralin 2018-07-31 10:39:02
Rostam works in off-hand (fettering was main hand)
By Boshi 2018-08-01 16:54:14
That page hasn't been updated in several years, and does seem rather overcomplicated for what it is. Most players are not going to understand, nor care about, the server-side handling of the math involved. However, the basics are pretty clear.
Haste/Slow from gear/magic are applied directly to the base recast additively. Then 1/2 Fast Cast is applied to the result additively. Then JA modifiers are applied to that result multiplicatively. Don't think that BLU has any JA mods, so it boils down to: BaseRecast - Haste + Slow + .5FC(floored), with a lower limit of .2 for the total.
If/when aiming for capped recast reduction, I just follow the basic rules of combat haste (256/1024 gear + 448/1024 magic) then tack on .5FC(floored) and the oddball direct reduction piece. Sure, it might be possible that I am not actually perfectly capped and sitting at something like .2003 recast time, but I for one am not going to notice 1-2 frames of animation longer on my recasts. XD
For the record though, the following should have your recasts capped for BLU:
Capped gear (+25% applied, +26% on gear to be sure) + Erratic Flutter (+30%) + Might Guard/Marches (+15%) + Hashishin Bazubands+1 (+14%)
OR
Capped gear (+25% applied, +26% on gear to be sure) + Erratic Flutter (+30%) + Hashishin Bazubands+1 (+14%) + FastCast+22% (maybe +24% to be safe and account for specific haste values on gear if you are at exactly +25% there.)
Merely setting Erratic Flutter w/ the 1200JP gift gives you FC+15% to begin with, which means you only have FC+7% to make up for w/ additional JT tiers and/or gear, so it's actually quite easy to cap out recasts on
BLU. While this works in theorycraft, it does not work in the game.
With Erratic set for fc included.
All spells casts with capped gear haste + erratic + mg :: always with capped magic+gear haste.
all +fc is from gear
Occulation base time: 90seconds
Occultation naked, 0 magic haste: 83 seconds
(take account 15 fc from erratic)
Occulation capped gear haste, 0 magic haste: 62 seconds
following below all have capped magic + gear haste:
Occultation with +0 fc = 25 seconds
Occultation with +0fc + empy hands = 22 seconds
Occultation with +22fc + empy hands = 19 seconds
Occultation with +23fc = 22 seconds
Occultation with +23fc + empy hands = 18 seconds
Occultation with +48fc = 19 seconds
Occultation with +49fc = 18 seconds
18/90= 0.2 (20%) minimal delay.
to make sure this is lowest possible:
Occultation with +72fc and empy hands = 18 seconds
Conclusion:
-With fc+15 from erratic set, under max haste you need +49FC to cap.
-If you are using empy hands you need +23FC more to cap.
-the 14% delay equates to the fc from 26%fc (should be 28%)
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By DaneBlood 2018-08-20 18:01:59
for blu ambuscade nuking cape
Should dye be int or magical dmg ?
Server: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 109
By Asura.Sirtaint 2018-08-20 18:16:05
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Phoenix.Capuchin
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 3613
By Phoenix.Capuchin 2018-08-28 14:29:11
Was cleaning up my BLU sets last night after not really touching the job for quite some time, and I'm not quite sure about current meta for non-RMEA melee approach. In general, which of the following should I do:
(a) Tanmogayi +1/Hep. Sapara +1 and prioritize Savage Blade, or
(b) Tanmogayi +1/Colada and prioritize CdC, or
(c) Some other non-RMEA weapon pair?
Assumptions:
* Fairly good but not absurd god-tier Colada augs (e.g., my current offhand Colada choices are something like one with DMG+14 DEX+15 Acc+20 and DA+2, and another with DMG+10 DEX+12 Acc+18 STP+5)
* Fairly strong Savage WSD set, but again not perfect. WSD+9% Herc Helm, WSD+8% Herc Vest, Jhakri+2 hands, STR/WSD cape, etc. (but since I've been away from BLU for quite a while, I don't have any AF/Relic +3 pieces yet)
Thanks!
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