Cursna Facts

I'm surprised there isn't a topic dedicated to this already. While there is some information in the main thread, it's perhaps nice to accumulate what's known in its own thread to make it easier to find.

For starters, let's get these two revelations by the devs out of the way:

1) When the item “Holy Water” is used, regardless of the user’s other status, the removal rate is 33%.

2) Hallowed water gives no benefit over holy water for curse removal.

I'm gonna put down spoiler tags now for people who don't care about the details.

In other words, cursna success rate = (10% + healing magic skill/30) + equip-modifer%(10% + healing magic skill/30)

or as Snaps put it: R = (10 + s/30)*(1 + c/100)
s - Healing magic skill
c - Cursna success rate+

For the sake of completeness, here is a list of equipment with a cursna modifier:

Ephedra Ring: Enhances "Cursna" effect (+10%)*
Haoma's Ring: Enhances "Cursna" effect (+15%)*
Malison Medallion: Enhances "Cursna" effect (+10%)*
Debilis Medallion: Enhances "Cursna" effect (+15%)*
Hieros Mittens: Enhances "Cursna" effect (+10%)*
Fanatic Gloves: Cursna +15 (healing magic 0-10)
**Mending Cape: Enhances "Cursna" effect (15%), healing magic skill 1-10%
**Alaunus's Cape: Cursna +25
**Gendewitha Galoshes: Enhances "Cursna" effect (+5)
**Gende. Galosh. +1: Cursna +10
**Vanya Clogs: Cursna +5 (+ 40 healing skill path B)
Theophany Pantaloons: Enhances "Cursna" effect
Theo. Pant. +1: Cursna +15
Gambanteinn (Level 119 III): Cursna +100

Purity Ring: Potency of "Cursna" effects received 7%
Saida Ring: Enhances effect of "Cursna" received (15%)*
Eshmun's Ring: Enhances effect of "Cursna" received (20%)*
Gishdubar Sash: Potency of "Cursna" effects received 10%
shabti cuisses: Potency of "Cursna" effects received 10% (non-ilevel)
shabti cuisses +1: Potency of "Cursna" effects received 15% (non-ilevel)

* Values based on Square Enix's Offical FFXI 2013 Guide. These books have been known to be incorrect though
** Values can vary further with augments


As for how the "cursna received" gear fits into the equation, it could be factored in exactly as the other cursna gear, which as Snaps put it:

R = (10 + s/30)*(1 + c/100)*(1 + r/100)

s - Healing magic skill
c - Cursna success rate+
r - Cursna received success rate+

but there hasn't been any real testing so far.

Chiaia put together an easy-to-use Cursna success rate calculator here: http://chiaia.optic-ice.com/Cursna.html

Do we know if Cursna Received+ is added with Cursna+ or multiplied like with Cure Potency Received+ and Cure Potency+?

There are two translated posts that I know of that address cursna+ gear.

Kincard's translation, post 1

Kincard's translation, post 2
You could assume additive from the first post, but either stat taken alone would literally do exactly as stated in the post even if they are multiplicative.

I think I'd like it tested directly to be certain. Testing to confirm would be a lot simpler now that we have an exact skill formula. and can project exactly what results we should be getting for a given skill/cursna/cursna received set.

moshimoshi modos desu


all of this information is explained in the bgwiki and looks to be pretty much copied from bgwiki
utilizing the same source material, even

anyway, it seems unnecessary to make a thread when all this is already compiled

https://www.bg-wiki.com/bg/Cursna

ok bye

I think you've miss-credited me for some of this. While I have done cursna testing and posted it, the specific values you're referencing(the 1A,B,4 tests) look like Prothescar's tests.

The tests I recall posting were actually done on various doom aura mobs. And while I know I tried the mortal ray method after hearing about it from prothescar, I don't recall if I ever gathered a significant enough sample to post....

My posts is here.

Prothe's are Here and here. Or you can just scroll down form my post. It's all in the same BG thread.

Yeah, I knew you had done some and Prothescar had done others, but I couldn't for the life of me remember how to spell Prothescar's name. ;p Anyways I'll edit the post to credit both of you. Thank you for providing the links; I had simply copy-pasted the whole discussion into a file a while back for data reference.


Of course it's from the same source material, it's all from the dev's posts as well as player testing. As for it also being posted on BG Wiki, that's kind of irrelevant (and some of this was posted by JP devs only yesterday, so I'm not sure why you seem to be surprised that this subject is being brought up *now*). General WHM information is also posted on BG-wiki as well as the old wiki - so by your reasoning, we shouldn't even have a WHM thread on FFXIAH? Keep in mind this is a forum, which means its purpose is facilitating discussion. If I list facts in the OP, it's to make the information more easily accessible and to encourage comments.

For example, we could talk about how off Prothescar's numbers were, now that we know the actual formula. Unfortunately, we still lack formulas for a lot of things in this game, and our best guess is through random samplings like these. If our best guess can be off by as much as 2-8% with a sample size of around 100, should we be aiming for higher numbers? (though I give props to those who had the dedication to test even this high a number). You can see how much difficulty this sampling error caused when trying to jam the numbers into the formula to make it work (the whole reason we couldn't even be sure it didn't work in a tier system).

Or we could bring up questions that are buried in the main thread, to keep people from having to search for them (and you can bet these questions will come up again). For example, I first got interested in the cursna formula because I was trying to see what gave me the best success rate:

Mending Cape (15% + 10 skill)
or
Alaunus's Cape (10 more cursna and 10 less skill)

This was a bigger issue when there was the possibility that the healing skill modifier worked in tiers, in which case losing that 10 skill might not be worth gaining 10 more cursna percentage points. But now it's clear that when dealing with numbers *around the same ballpark* (adding 10 healing skill vs adding 10 cursna%), you get a bigger boost from the cursna modifier. I'll hide the math in spoiler tags so the post doesn't get too long:

Another gear switch I was debating was Vanya feet (5 less cursna but 40 more skill) vs. Gende +1 feet. This time the difference is much greater (we're talking 40 skill points). Again I'll hide the math in spoiler tags.

There you have it, some actual discussion! Feel free to fit this somewhere on BG wiki if you want to, Foxfire. =p

The way you're expressing that is overly complex.

R = (10 + s/30)*(1 + c/100)
s - Healing magic skill
c - Cursna success rate+

We haven't tested how Cursna received gear functions, but I would assume the following.

R = (10 + s/30)*(1 + c/100)*(1 + r/100)
s - Healing magic skill
c - Cursna success rate
r - Cursna received success rate+

I agree that your way of writing it out looks prettier and is probably more proper, but I'm not sure I'd say it's less complex (at least for people like me, for whom math isn't always intuitive). I like seeing where my numbers are coming from, and when you replace terms like the second half of the equation "+ cursna gear%(10+ healing skill/30)" with "*(1 + c/100)", I have a harder time making sense of it. More importantly, I have a harder time visualizing how it directly relates to the first half of the equation, which uses the same variables: "(10+ healing skill/30)". In other words, I have an easier time *seeing* how the cursna percentage contributes to the final product versus how the healing skill does, when it's all spelled out this way. It also fits with the way the devs described it in words, "Equipment that increase the effects of Cursna will multiply with the base removal rate rather than simply adding to the percentage value."

That said, I am completely ok with writing the equation out the way you have it. I'll go ahead and add it to the OP.

Based on the new info, I made a little calculator to mess around with. Though I still believe we have more to find out.



Can be found here: http://chiaia.optic-ice.com/Cursna.html

I made it quick so it does allow you to go over 100% and its allows more % then currently in-game.

So is it the variables that are throwing you off or the distributive property? Because I think the main overcomplication being used was the unnecessary and kind of counterintuitive repetition of the (10+ healing skill/30) part

It's not so much that it throws me off to have it written out that way, but that having the second term (equip contribution) displayed alongside the first term (healing skill contribution) visually emphasizes how the two are connected. And while I agree it's ugly and redundant, when I am making my gear comparisons and trying to describe why a high healing skill may not fully compensate for a reduced Cursna gear option, it seems clearer to me when it's shown that your overall success rate accounts for Cursna gear as an additional bonus percentage of your healing skill contribution. I suppose this sort of concept is more intuitive for some people, but I'm more of a visual learner/"big picture" type, and I like having things written out fully so I can better grasp how it all connects.

Nice calculator, Chiaia! I'll stick a link up in the OP

Forgive the Necrobump but my curiosity is burning this question into my mind now.

I use a WHM mule with Yagrush but I only felt it necessary to bring the Yagrush to lv.75. My question is if that Magic Accuracy Skill adds to the Cursna's potency or not since it functions strictly on Healing Magic Skill?. Does anyone know if has anything at all to do with the success rates before I get to spamming WS Trials? lol

Edit:
My whole thing is that I think the bulk of the testing compiled was done with 117-119 gear if I'm not mistaken. So any weapons being used would already have the "Magic Accuracy Skill" already on the weapon. It probably has nothing to do with it at all but I figure there's no harm in asking to be sure.

Cool! I was not looking forward to dealing with WS Trials, PW farming, etc.. So glad to hear it xD


I agree with you *BUT* I will say this is debated (Sometimes Fiercely) by the WHMs in my shell xD There's a strong opinion that a 65%~ AoE is better than a 90-100% Single Target.

Me personally, I'm not in a situation where I'm taking on heavy Doom very often with my mule but if I take up tanking, I'm making that Gamb lol

Thank you for the reply