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Campaign Sham?
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
By Fenrir.Luarania 2010-07-16 16:26:40
Alexander.Tidusblitz said: Fenrir.Luarania said: Actually this thread started off as a QQ about how campaign sucked since mobs died way to quickly now. Then it turned into people giving ideas on what SE could do to fix it, and finally turned into ideas we as players could do to fix it. Sure there was some haters, nothing major and it usually happen, but then you came along and shat across everything we have done and made it into this fine mess. Good job on ruining not only campaign battles, but attempts to fix it, does that make you feel happy inside? Only person I've been calling stupid is you, you're posts show it and your own logic shows it. Sev attacked the first name calling against soloer person whoever that was and Vinvv just happened to get caught in the crossfire, really doesn't look like he did anything and personal I'd like to see him stop getting railed. If I have abandoned logic then how come my posts are usually pretty well thought out and long? I am personally attacking you cause well, you are personally attacking me too. You seem to have gave up your logic a long time ago and see your own self as some kind of campaign hero for killing soloer mobs. Yeah thats pretty lame You have also not once in this entire thread gave any reasons as to how to make this problem better. Sure you have said you are killing the mob, but thats not really solving it now is it? It takes what, 30-45 minutes roughly for a unit to recover after a loss? What are we going to do when there are no battles for 25-35 straight minutes? I at least have stated that I'm going to test varies ideas and see what can work, and I'm betting Sev is already planning some too. Seriously, you need to do three things. A) Stop posting. B) get out of this thread, and C) get out of these forums. Go to BG or KI and try stating such stuff there, might get a heck of a lot more support for your stupid ways than you could ever on here. Length and knowing what you are talking about, the key to being right. I see it all now. Fix'd that for you, don't screw it up again. Should take some lessons from the math folks, though I'm sure you'll just get laughed at more.
Alexander.Tidusblitz said: Fenrir.Luarania said: You have to be trolling and I'm done with you. Your logic alone proves how utterly stupid and unwilling to change you are, and thats another reason this game is dying. I can only be glad that I'm on Fenrir and don't have to deal with idoits like you. From yesterday, please do this. Do it somewhere far from me. Awww did I hit a nerve? Yeah that was yesterday with no sleep, I actually just woke up and got 300 more WSs to do till I complete my trial, so come on, entertain me. Sadly this could have been a very interesting discussion, but nope you had to go and /rage out and ruin it for everyone.
I'm going to hang around this and keep bumping it so people can take an interest and read (Be sure to check pages 2-3 for information 4+ is for the lulz) and get more laughs from seeing how moronic you can be.
So if you can't handle it, piss off.
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Alexander.Tidusblitz
Server: Alexander
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1252
By Alexander.Tidusblitz 2010-07-16 16:30:13
Fenrir.Luarania said: Alexander.Tidusblitz said: Fenrir.Luarania said: Actually this thread started off as a QQ about how campaign sucked since mobs died way to quickly now. Then it turned into people giving ideas on what SE could do to fix it, and finally turned into ideas we as players could do to fix it. Sure there was some haters, nothing major and it usually happen, but then you came along and shat across everything we have done and made it into this fine mess. Good job on ruining not only campaign battles, but attempts to fix it, does that make you feel happy inside? Only person I've been calling stupid is you, you're posts show it and your own logic shows it. Sev attacked the first name calling against soloer person whoever that was and Vinvv just happened to get caught in the crossfire, really doesn't look like he did anything and personal I'd like to see him stop getting railed. If I have abandoned logic then how come my posts are usually pretty well thought out and long? I am personally attacking you cause well, you are personally attacking me too. You seem to have gave up your logic a long time ago and see your own self as some kind of campaign hero for killing soloer mobs. Yeah thats pretty lame You have also not once in this entire thread gave any reasons as to how to make this problem better. Sure you have said you are killing the mob, but thats not really solving it now is it? It takes what, 30-45 minutes roughly for a unit to recover after a loss? What are we going to do when there are no battles for 25-35 straight minutes? I at least have stated that I'm going to test varies ideas and see what can work, and I'm betting Sev is already planning some too. Seriously, you need to do three things. A) Stop posting. B) get out of this thread, and C) get out of these forums. Go to BG or KI and try stating such stuff there, might get a heck of a lot more support for your stupid ways than you could ever on here. Length and knowing what you are talking about, the key to being right. I see it all now. Fix'd that for you, don't screw it up again. Should take some lessons from the math folks, though I'm sure you'll just get laughed at more.
Alexander.Tidusblitz said: Fenrir.Luarania said: You have to be trolling and I'm done with you. Your logic alone proves how utterly stupid and unwilling to change you are, and thats another reason this game is dying. I can only be glad that I'm on Fenrir and don't have to deal with idoits like you. From yesterday, please do this. Do it somewhere far from me. Awww did I hit a nerve? Yeah that was yesterday with no sleep, I actually just woke up and got 300 more WSs to do till I complete my trial, so come on, entertain me. Sadly this could have been a very interesting discussion, but nope you had to go and /rage out and ruin it for everyone.
I'm going to hang around this and keep bumping it so people can take an interest and read (Be sure to check pages 2-3 for information 4 is for the lulz) and get more laughs from seeing how moronic you can be.
So if you can't handle it, piss off.
You know what your talking about according to 2 people in this thread, one being you. You have been repeatedly told your not right in this thread(note how i didnt say wrong, because neither side is right), And id guess that less then 5% of the ffxi population reads these forums. So barring you saying you might try it in the future, your advice does nothing.
Edit: the math folks should take a lesson from me.
This is the sun, it lights the world. Those fluorescent lights above you are not the only light source.
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Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
By Fenrir.Luarania 2010-07-16 16:47:54
I know what I am talking about cause I bother to do research and ask questions. Also having experianced getting 5k as PLD/WAR is a good feeling, and how did I pull that off? I knew what I was doing.
Actually the only person I recall telling me I'm not right is you. I disreegarded that anon post, stinks to much of an alternate account unless I am proven wrong. Nither side may be right, but I wouldn't be surprised if you have earned the hate of people from the side you claim to support, not everyone likes quick campaign battles.
Personally I'm not going to try and solve it for each server. Enough of the sensible Fenririan's read these forums and would probably assist me, and once again Fenrir is a bit laid back, I could probably convince a few random people to assist me in exchange for gil, which if I theories turn out right, could very well start a small but steadly growing revoultion as word spreads.
This thread will probably not get viewed as often as it should because of the title, the main reason I wanted to start a new thread. People see that title and think "Oh god, another QQ campaign thread."
My advice is usually pretty sound, and the times I'm actually wrong aren't many. Once again, have you been giving out any advice or solutions to solve this?
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Ramuh.Vinvv
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15542
By Ramuh.Vinvv 2010-07-16 16:56:42
this dead horse must be in pieces by now.
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Alexander.Tidusblitz
Server: Alexander
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1252
By Alexander.Tidusblitz 2010-07-16 16:59:29
You dont know what your talking about because campaigns sole purpose is not exp. let me spell it out for you... I D O W H A T I W A N T. If i want to take 5 of my friends into campaign and destroy every mob in 15 seconds, i can. Because SE designed it to be a free thing with no real goal or purpose. Yes you get exp, but there are at least 10 more efficient ways, so the fact that your this serious about campaign exp is a joke.
Phoenix.Elanabelle said: Cerberus.Tidis said:
I used to hate people dragging mobs off but i'll do that now, I guess not drag them halfway across the map but I always try to make sure i'm soloing a mob.
If DDs start showing up on my mob and grab hate, I will disengage and look for a new mob, you got hate so don't whinge about me leaving the mob when i'm entitled to do so, if you die and it comes after me I don't care either.
You, sir, are a mega-douchebag. Campaign isn't for "solo'ing a mob". If it was designed for that, then S-E wouldn't have allowed others to engage an already claimed mob.
I understand the mechanics of Campaign XP, and I get that you'll get more XP per battle if you're off in left field solo'ing. But, like most things in FFXI, if you're greedy, people are going to call you out for it, period.
If you want to solo, go play a regular RPG, not a MMORPG.
Ramuh.Vinvv said: Phoenix.Elanabelle said: Cerberus.Tidis said:
I used to hate people dragging mobs off but i'll do that now, I guess not drag them halfway across the map but I always try to make sure i'm soloing a mob.
If DDs start showing up on my mob and grab hate, I will disengage and look for a new mob, you got hate so don't whinge about me leaving the mob when i'm entitled to do so, if you die and it comes after me I don't care either.
You, sir, are a mega-douchebag. Campaign isn't for "solo'ing a mob". If it was designed for that, then S-E wouldn't have allowed others to engage an already claimed mob.
I understand the mechanics of Campaign XP, and I get that you'll get more XP per battle if you're off in left field solo'ing. But, like most things in FFXI, if you're greedy, people are going to call you out for it, period.
If you want to solo, go play a regular RPG, not a MMORPG. I actually agree with this to an extent, at least the message of the statement, perhaps not the silly name calling.
Phoenix.Darki said: Fenrir.Luarania said:
Also doing what you wanna do is pretty stupid to say considering you sound like one of those that want campaign to be a group effort, bum rush everything, and end the battle in under a minute.
People already do whatever they want on the game, and on campaign specifically when they pull mobs away to solo them. I don't see where it's bad to beat everything to a pulp if that's all she wants to do.
Leviathan.Draylo said: I've always said the one thing that would at least make campaign more bearable is having mobs auto unaggro once you get too far from the fort and giving mobs a TON of HP so fights last longer. Either a ton of HP or more defense, Hp preferable since its fun dealing a lot of dmg unlike besiged. So give them like 100k HP etc, you know.
Sylph.Rawkhawk said: Elwynbelwyn said: Sylph.Rawkhawk said: Someone once posted (possibly on this forum) that a good solution would be, you lose your Allied Tags once you get so far from the fort. I thought that was perfect really, would mean you couldn't drag them all over the place, would give non-widescan jobs a small area to search. Except for one thing. BST. I've been playing BST in campaign the past few weeks, and making an effort to avoid jugs. Most campaign zones don't have many useful charmables, and you have to walk quite a ways to get them. And Northlands zones have nothing charmable at all. Oh, sure BST can use jugs. Jugs which suck before 76, and are consumables. How would the SAMs like it if your only awesome swords, you had to buy stacks of them, and they break when you zone out? And it's been fun just trying to find stuff I can charm. The number one thing they need to do is scale back the NPCs based on how many people show up, because the NPCs eat up all the XP, and that's the real reason everybody runs out to the mobs now. I also like the "everybody gets wide scan on campaign mobs only" idea. Or maybe they could just scale back the exp multiplier to x4 at 76 instead of x6 on all zones except northlands and strongholds. But everyone knows what SE is going to do, and it starts with "jack". Oh, but let there even seem to be an exploit and it gets ninja patched with extreme prejudice. Oh yeah, and HEY SE! FORT BATTLES ALWAYS SUCKED AND STILL DO BUT AT LEAST WE USED TO GET EXP. The real problem was that the dungeon zones were laid out so badly that you could bash on a fort and the mobs would never see you, at least not unless someone MPK dragged them to the fort. Especially in Eldieme, with the CA right there. Nobody ever went AFK on the other forts because they'd get ganked real quick. Now you can't even get the minimum 300xp to lot loot if you missed the mobs that left half an hour ago, unless you can slash your wrists enough times on a local mob for the healing xp. Caitsith.Neonracer said: I use my Empress ring alot more in campaign LOLWUT. You know that does nothing for campaign exp, right?
(Sorry for the delayed reaction, missed this thread being bumped I guess)
I campaign on BST, so I see your point, maybe change it to unable to gain any hate outside of set area? So you can roam without losing tags, but the mobs are going to flee-speed run past you towards the fort until they are close enough to allow enmity to build. Drag a mob to far away? Enmity lost, he turns and runs back to fort. Saith said: The argument "it's my money, I'll play how I want" is valid. Too bad if people don't like it, because nobody will do anything about it. It's a game, and this argument/thread feels like 9 year olds holding a committee in a small club, and getting pissed when the adult bursts their bubble how they can't do anything to change something out of their control. Instead of getting pissed at the people who play how they want because THEY are paying for the game, then... how about you just play how you want, and not *** about it? If this thread is about ideas, then don't bash someone when their focus is different from yours, or the majority, or the minority. In the end, its a furking game, you don't like it, go back to single player mode. It ain't that serious.
All quotes from this very thread supporting me. Some are just round about ways of saying dragging mobs far is HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE, but the point is there.
Phoenix.Darki
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9949
By Phoenix.Darki 2010-07-16 17:00:13
What dead horse... Its beef already
Alexander.Tidusblitz
Server: Alexander
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1252
By Alexander.Tidusblitz 2010-07-16 17:00:47
Beef is cows? >.>
Bahamut.Serj
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6179
By Bahamut.Serj 2010-07-16 17:00:58
Phoenix.Darki said: What dead horse... Its beef already
Since when is.... beef...... horse meat.....?
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
By Fenrir.Luarania 2010-07-16 17:01:40
I think it got obliterated back on page 4 somewhere...
Even still I'm debating on if a new thread just for idea gathering from everyone that wants to help figure this out, either via SE or via the community, should be made. I still have faith in the FFXI community that we alone could solve this somehow.
*edited to avoid double post*
Campaign is exp to those jobs that can't get exp. Yup sure we got Abyssea now so that may not matter to much now, and I haven't been in it often enough to know if all those jobs that got neglected before get to have a shining light now.
Also the point that pulling a mob from the fort has always been valid. Yup it sucks, it can be a pain in the rear to find them, but it is helpful and you can kill tags. If you want the loot for gil, might as well go farm something. Probably get more gil/hour on average from a simple item than what you'll get out of campaign.
None of those points really support you, as the whole reason you've been 'attacked' is cause you want to pull a *** move and ruining campaign for everyone else. It's at that point that the 'I do what I want' statements become stupid. Yeah it's a game, yeah you pay a monthly fee. For the most part you can do what you want but there is a little thing called respect which you seem to lack greatly.
Hence how the ninja lotting statement that you didn't get earlier was thrown at you. If your statment of "I can do what I want because I pay for this, and nothing I do is wrong" stands true, then I should be able to ninja lot Dyna, get as many drops as I can, and walk out and it would be totally justifable. As I pay for this game so I can do whatever it is I want and nothing I do is wrong at all. Thats pretty much what you are saying it seems.
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Bahamut.Serj
Server: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6179
By Bahamut.Serj 2010-07-16 17:04:03
I have no idea what's going on in this thread, but I support Luarania because of his avatar =3
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Ramuh.Vinvv
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15542
By Ramuh.Vinvv 2010-07-16 17:04:14
Phoenix.Darki said: What dead horse... Its beef already Apparently they eat horse in Cuba. who'd have known.
Phoenix.Darki
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9949
By Phoenix.Darki 2010-07-16 17:13:33
Fenrir.Luarania said: I think it got obliterated back on page 4 somewhere...
Even still I'm debating on if a new thread just for idea gathering from everyone that wants to help figure this out, either via SE or via the community, should be made. I still have faith in the FFXI community that we alone could solve this somehow. Thats a conspiracy because almost no one reads this sites forums. Go to BG if youre that serious thouughh i am positive youre gonna get flamed badly
Phoenix.Darki
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9949
By Phoenix.Darki 2010-07-16 17:14:34
Im not cuban vinvv get yourfacts straight.
I confused it, i meant the meat was already grinded.
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
By Fenrir.Luarania 2010-07-16 17:17:58
Phoenix.Darki said: Fenrir.Luarania said: I think it got obliterated back on page 4 somewhere... Even still I'm debating on if a new thread just for idea gathering from everyone that wants to help figure this out, either via SE or via the community, should be made. I still have faith in the FFXI community that we alone could solve this somehow. Thats a conspiracy because almost no one reads this sites forums. Go to BG if youre that serious thouughh i am positive youre gonna get flamed badly I don't go to BG or KI, all those people ever seemed to care about was e-peen and thinking they were FFXI's 4chan, which is sadly what I am seeing on this site more and more as the days go.
*Edit* Bahamut.Serj said: I have no idea what's going on in this thread, but I support Luarania because of his avatar =3 lol just saw that. While I thank you for that, please don't support Sev and I unless you feel that what we are doing is something you agree with.
The point of this thread was to spread information around and get people more aware of how campaign works with the side goal of both sides reaching some sort of agreement and making campaign not only work, but better for everyone. It's just... it got turned into this mess and now it's pretty much worthless. If you have any questions pages 2-3 have good info and you can always PM someone from this thread about it. While I do support the soloing side I try not to be biased and sit in the middle. I was once in that mob of people that killed everyone too, and hated solor's for taking mobs far away at one time.
Ramuh.Vinvv
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15542
By Ramuh.Vinvv 2010-07-16 17:21:28
Phoenix.Darki said: Im not cuban vinvv get yourfacts straight.
I confused it, i meant the meat was already grinded. I definitely remember you saying that you were a Cuban Creamer.
Phoenix.Darki
Server: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9949
By Phoenix.Darki 2010-07-16 17:22:21
Youd be surprised if you knew on BG they take ***more seriously than here. Theres just a lot of trolls, regardless its still a good site for information and moving crowds. But you are gonna get flamed for this because people dont care and will keep playing however they wAnt. Now if you chose to stay here all you are getting is arguments and dead ends. You have more chances at BG imo..
Vinvv im boricua. Not cuban im not from cuba
Ramuh.Vinvv
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15542
By Ramuh.Vinvv 2010-07-16 17:27:04
Phoenix.Darki said: Youd be surprised if you knew on BG they take ***more seriously than here. Theres just a lot of trolls, regardless its still a good site for information and moving crowds. But you are gonna get flamed for this because people dont care and will keep playing however they wAnt. Now if you chose to stay here all you are getting is arguments and dead ends. You have more chances at BG imo..
Vinvv im boricua. Not cuban im not from cuba I'm pretty sure I remember you saying that you were Cuban.
Server: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
By Fenrir.Luarania 2010-07-16 17:28:41
Phoenix.Darki said: Youd be surprised if you knew on BG they take ***more seriously than here. Theres just a lot of trolls, regardless its still a good site for information and moving crowds. But you are gonna get flamed for this because people dont care and will keep playing however they wAnt. Now if you chose to stay here all you are getting is arguments and dead ends. You have more chances at BG imo.. Something to keep in mind I suppose, BG does seem to have that 'center of information' thing. Maybe I will after I conduct my testing and if it actually works.
By Saith 2010-07-16 17:56:42
I just don't see what's wrong with Campaign as is now (Yes, I've read all 7 pages, and all about the tools to maximize exp, soloing, etc.) I just don't think it's that big of a deal, especially when if exp was the main focus, players can do much better in Parties, or Abyssea, or even soloing. Hell, it's about to be common to gain 200,000 exp a day in abyssea.
The reason that people won't care too deeply about the ideas posted albeit being valid ideas, is that Campaign was designed to be a mind-numbingly killing spree fun, without having to worry about what job you are, who's there, or how fast or slow you kill things, or the sub job you are; giving a break to the cookie cutter setups needed for everything else in the game. So trying to place structure into something that wasn't designed to have much of it doesn't appeal to me or some people. When Walk of echoes first came out the first thing said as a warning was "Don't use Campaign style tactics/jobs" implying that it required structure, while Campaign did not. It's one of the reasons people love Besieged, and Campaign is merely a set of a dozen Besiege environments to reduce congestion, and allow people to simply bash enemies how they want, when they want, while being able to reap exp, and rewards if enjoyed enough.
Ramuh.Vinvv
Server: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15542
By Ramuh.Vinvv 2010-07-16 17:59:43
Saith said: I just don't see what's wrong with Campaign as is now (Yes, I've read all 7 pages, and all about the tools to maximize exp, soloing, etc.)
I just don't think it's that big of a deal, especially when if exp was the main focus, players can do much better in Parties, or Abyssea, or even soloing. Hell, it's about to be common to gain 200,000 exp a day in abyssea.
The reason that people won't care too deeply about the ideas posted albeit being valid ideas, is that Campaign was designed to be a mind-numbingly killing spree fun
, without having to worry about what job you are, who's there, or how fast or slow you kill things, or the sub job you are; giving a break to the cookie cutter setups needed for everything else in the game.
So trying to place structure into something that wasn't designed to have much of it doesn't appeal to me or some people.
When Walk of echoes first came out the first thing said as a warning was "Don't use Campaign style tactics/jobs" implying that it required structure, while Campaign did not.
It's one of the reasons people love Besieged, and Campaign is merely a set of a dozen Besiege environments to reduce congestion, and allow people to simply bash enemies how they want, when they want, while being able to reap exp, and rewards if enjoyed enough. I read your whole post.
and I approve.
Leviathan.Helix
Server: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 109
By Leviathan.Helix 2010-07-17 09:07:38
No one is ever going to agree on this. Some people will gather information and learn a few things they maybe didn't know and it may or may not change their point of view. I "get" why people say "hey it's my money, I'll do what I want"...I feel that way about a few other things in the game as well.
To minimize the arguing, flaming and name calling, maybe this should be locked and 2 separate topics of "discussion" started. One topic, people can "discuss" the benefits of extending campaign time and how to accomplish that goal and the other people can "discuss" how they want to end the soloing and suggestions how to arrive at that goal.
It's more than likely a pipe dream anyway to assume that SE bothers reading this kinda stuff and implements the content. SUPPOSEDLY, SE has staff that reads the suggestions forum on ffxiclopedia...I don't really know for sure.
"IF" SE does read these things, who is to say they are going to listen to the loudest voice anyway, they will more than likey take the stance "it's our bat, our ball and our rules...don't like it? Don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya on your way out"
Carbuncle.Zanno
Server: Carbuncle
Game: FFXI
Posts: 2849
By Carbuncle.Zanno 2010-07-17 10:18:44
I dont understand what everyone is QQing about.
Some ppl might enjoy CB, I dont. I'm just seeing it as a way to get a bit of exp while waiting on an invite. Especially now when I'm trying to get thf up to 80.
I'm there for the exp and nothing else.
Ofcourse I'm trying to grab a mob and keep it to myself to get max exp. But I'm sure as hell not gonna get pissed off and go all crazy over it on an internet forum if someone else starts beating on my mob.
Why?
Because it dont matter lol. Just because I QQ on the forum on how gimp/low lv/idiots and what not are beating on "my mob" in campaign battle, they sure as hell arent gonna listen and think the next time they see me solo a mob.
"Hey, thats the guy that made it clear on a forum that he wanna solo his mobs, lets leave him alone and find another one, ok?"
Server: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 21
By Cerberus.Unfrgvnhate 2010-07-17 11:04:10
it comes down to the people who play this game are a bunch of selfish ***.. if they not screwing you over with exp in camps, or campaigns they gonna *** with the AH and undercut, if you waiting to get claim they will bot. In the end *** will be ***. Just got to move on..
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I just got back from a Campaign Battle in Rolanberry Fields against the Vhuud Vanguard. After the message "A Campaign battle has begun", I waited for 30 minutes. Nothing ever showed up, and no message saying that they were approaching came up. The "battle" ended. After I got back to Windy, a message said that the Vhuud Vanaguard had "suffered defeat".
WTF? Am I missing something?
After looking at Bastok's reconnaisance level, it was only 5. So the "approaching" message probably wouldn't have shown up, but still; do people just camp where they come into the zone? There were still tons of people waiting at the outpost, and none of us got a chance to do anything. Is this a problem other people have had?
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